Group B - India, Pakistan, South Africa, Sri Lanka

[TheJediBrah]

Not really sure why any of you guys are arguing with me on this tbh, I'm literally just stating an objective fact. It's not really a debatable topic or something you can really disagree with.

India have had some easy-beat preliminary finals in World Cups, and it's been lucky. That's a simple fact. No other teams have. And, no, they didn't "earn" it by finishing on top. Australia went through 2 World Cups undefeated and didn't get an easy-beat final.

Really can't understand why there is any argument on this at all.

 

[srbhkshk]

India have had some easy-beat preliminary finals in World Cups, and it's been lucky. That's a simple fact. No other teams have. And, no, they didn't "earn" it by finishing on top. Australia went through 2 World Cups undefeated and didn't get an easy-beat final.

Only the 2003 example stands, and iirc India won every single game they played in that tourney except for the 2 against Australia so it's not as if it really mattered. As far as 2015 is concerned, India did very much earn it by finishing on the top of the group, NZ/Aus got WI/Pak in the same way who are not particularly better than BD except for a minority of special performance days.

 

[Moss]

2003 is a facile example if you only were to look at India's semifinal opponents.

Sri Lanka, who were Australia's opponents in the semis, and NZ who ended up missing out on a semifinal spot because they had refused to travel to Kenya during the group stages, were both beaten comfortably by India in the super sixes. So too were Pakistan and England in the group stages.

 

[honestbharani]

That's just TJB on a day Australia were knocked out. Can we move on?

 

[centurymaker]

How is Bangladesh an easy beat opponent in ODIs?? If so, then so is New Zealand, and so is Pakistan, West Indies, Sri Lanka

In your mind you are carrying the entire history of Bangladesh when you are assessing how they are NOW.. or how they have performed in recent years in One-day games.

Truth is that Bangladesh's regularly been beating top ODI sides in the last few years.. Fact is that they are NO longer any worse than the teams above (roughly speaking).

-India lost their bi-lateral series 2-1 to them after 2015 World Cup
-Pakistan lost 3-0 to them
-South Africa too lost a series.
-They have consistently knocked out established teams in ICC tournaments because they have out-performed the "preconceived" (so called) top sides!
-They almost knocked out India in India in group stage of last years T20 world cup, beaten by 1 run..
-They have made Asia Cup finals in recent years i.e. they have finished at least 2nd best among all Asian teams.

These are the FACTS! They are no longer a minnow in ODIs/limited overs. If they are, then same applies to NZ, West Indies etc.
(They have beaten NZ in 2 consecutive games now (away from home).. last game in Ireland & now in champions trophy)

-Bangladesh is ranked 6th in ODIs or maybe Sri Lanka has gone past.. Pakistan is 8th, West Indies 9th.

I fail to see HOW they are an easy beat opponent. If they are, then they are as easy as Sri Lanka (who beat India) or Pakistan.. (who India thrashed) and one of these two teams will face England in the other semi-final.. how lucky are England to get an easy beat 7th/8th ranked side in the semis, direct ticket to finals.

 

[Anil]

so south africa is out now right? either sri lanka or pakistan will join india in the semis..?

 

[honestbharani]

Yep

 

[Agar]

If Bangladesh are a minnow, then the argument also stands that the Group B teams (Ind, SL, SA, Pak) were deprived of an easy 2 points in the group stage, lowering their individual chances of qualifying for the Semifinal in comparison to the 3 'strong' teams in Group A.

India have earned their KO against Bangladesh by virtue of topping the 'tougher' group.

 

[Shri]

That's a fair point, but still BD were an easier task than the team that finished the top of the other group got. (Assuming it was WI? Who were tough in that tournament with near full-strength strong side).

Basically in 2003 they were effectively guaranteed a spot in the final just by making the top 4, and in 2015 they were effectively guaranteed a spot in the semi-final just by making the Quarters

Australia got lucky in the final. No other team would have conceded 340.

 

[quincywagstaff]

Am I right in saying South Africa haven't made the final of a Champions Trophy, ODI WC (or T20 WC for that matter) since 1998? Pretty incredible, especially as they've generally been a very good ODI side in that time.

 

[honestbharani]

They won the inaugural CT It was not called that then but they did.

 

[ankitj]

Which happened in 1998. So he is right. Since 1998 it hasn't happened.

 

[honestbharani]

yeah my bad.. overlooked that part.

 

[Agar]

They won the inaugural CT It was not called that then but they did.

Given their track record in KO games, it is extremely ironic that South Africa won the only cricket tournament to ever be officially called the Knockout Trophy.

 

[Shri]

Nope NZ won the KO trophy in 2000 too.

 

[Black_Warrior]

How is Bangladesh an easy beat opponent in ODIs?? If so, then so is New Zealand, and so is Pakistan, West Indies, Sri Lanka

In your mind you are carrying the entire history of Bangladesh when you are assessing how they are NOW.. or how they have performed in recent years in One-day games.

Truth is that Bangladesh's regularly been beating top ODI sides in the last few years.. Fact is that they are NO longer any worse than the teams above (roughly speaking).

-India lost their bi-lateral series 2-1 to them after 2015 World Cup
-Pakistan lost 3-0 to them
-South Africa too lost a series.
-They have consistently knocked out established teams in ICC tournaments because they have out-performed the "preconceived" (so called) top sides!
-They almost knocked out India in India in group stage of last years T20 world cup, beaten by 1 run..
-They have made Asia Cup finals in recent years i.e. they have finished at least 2nd best among all Asian teams.

These are the FACTS! They are no longer a minnow in ODIs/limited overs. If they are, then same applies to NZ, West Indies etc.
(They have beaten NZ in 2 consecutive games now (away from home).. last game in Ireland & now in champions trophy)

-Bangladesh is ranked 6th in ODIs or maybe Sri Lanka has gone past.. Pakistan is 8th, West Indies 9th.

I fail to see HOW they are an easy beat opponent. If they are, then they are as easy as Sri Lanka (who beat India) or Pakistan.. (who India thrashed) and one of these two teams will face England in the other semi-final.. how lucky are England to get an easy beat 7th/8th ranked side in the semis, direct ticket to finals.

Watching C9 cricket coverage is the cricketing equivalent of Fox News coverage of world politics - you get a very narrow view of what happens outside. So yeah Bangladesh and Kenya are kinda same - minnows and playing to make up the numbers