Time for changes

[marc71178]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Time for changes

While we have Giles as a spinner we are never going to compete in this department until We have one GOOD enough, we have to make do with this over-rated player.

He has taken 55 wickets in 18 games, not a bad strike rate for one who plays in non-spin friendly conditions at least half the time.

He also concedes around 2.5 an over - so he can restrict teams as well.

I find it rather ironic that you say we're now don't have a good enough spinner, despite the hundreds of times you've stated in the past that we have leg spinners that are GOOD enough, but don't get the chance!

 

[marc71178]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Time for changes

The selectors are the real problem, That why i suggest Ian Botham for the spot he knows a hell of a lot about the game?

So much so that when we played Pakistan he didn't once mention the conditions, but when we played India he was constantly criticising them?

 

[marc71178]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Time for changes

I am consitantly fed up of people saying i am worcester bias.
Marc71178 you quote Ali and smith are " Not good Enough" well how do you know that.

Ali has potential maybe, but both of them are being pushed on the basis of one season for your county - Whilst Ali may perform for England eventually, he'll need to show he isn't a one season wonder.

Smith, on the other hand, would be a complete backward step and one which seems to go against the rest of your argument (ie you want youngsters in)

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

IMO, the reason why Australia managed to come back so well on Sunday, is beacause they know how to win....from any position. It's a mentality. If Australia had Australia 135/8, they would have finished it off because they have a killer instinct....it's what they do.

At the moment, no team has that instinct and as such, no team will compete consistently with them for some time.

 

[chris.hinton]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Time for changes

He has taken 55 wickets in 18 games, not a bad strike rate for one who plays in non-spin friendly conditions at least half the time.

He also concedes around 2.5 an over - so he can restrict teams as well.

I find it rather ironic that you say we're now don't have a good enough spinner, despite the hundreds of times you've stated in the past that we have leg spinners that are GOOD enough, but don't get the chance!

WOW he is not good enough 2.5 per over is not enough i perfer he to get 7/47 instead of 0/25 but giles is no Warne or Muril.

Marc 71178 i said this before Leg spinners do not get the chance but until they do ( in county Cricket) we have to make do with Ashley Giles but Blackwell is better

 

[chris.hinton]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Time for changes

Ali has potential maybe, but both of them are being pushed on the basis of one season for your county - Whilst Ali may perform for England eventually, he'll need to show he isn't a one season wonder.

Smith, on the other hand, would be a complete backward step and one which seems to go against the rest of your argument (ie you want youngsters in)

Ali is 22 and as an Excellent record, Smith has Performed well in the past 5 years but does not get a look in, And what this about Trughton being too young he is 24 and chance has come.

 

[chris.hinton]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Time for changes

WOW he is not good enough 2.5 per over is not enough i perfer he to get 7/47 instead of 0/25 but giles is no Warne or Muril.

Marc 71178 i said this before Leg spinners do not get the chance but until they do ( in county Cricket) we have to make do with Ashley Giles but Blackwell is better

Also that is test not oneday (So i coorect myself) he bowls very Flat in that

 

[marc71178]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Time for changes

WOW he is not good enough 2.5 per over is not enough i perfer he to get 7/47 instead of 0/25 but giles is no Warne or Muril.

Marc 71178 i said this before Leg spinners do not get the chance but until they do ( in county Cricket) we have to make do with Ashley Giles but Blackwell is better

How can you call Blackwell better?

Oh, now I remember, he doesn't play for Warwickshire.

Giles ties an end down effectively, AND is taking more than 3 a game (considering England play 5 bowlers, but rarely take all 20, that's about his fair share)

As for the Leg Spinner argument, you need to make your mind up, you've just said that we have no good spinner, yet the leg spinners around are good? Which one is it?

 

[marc71178]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Time for changes

Also that is test not oneday (So i coorect myself) he bowls very Flat in that

So you'd pick Ian Blackwell (93 wickets at 41+) as England's Test Spinner?

 

[marc71178]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Time for changes

Ali is 22 and as an Excellent record, Smith has Performed well in the past 5 years but does not get a look in, And what this about Trughton being too young he is 24 and chance has come.

Regarding youngsters, you say you want young players, but then choose a 31 year old.

Ben Smith performing well for the last 5 years, I disagree (FC averages for the last 5 seasons - 62.00, 34.85, 32.66, 43.64, 44.51 and OD of 31.12, 30.21, 34.72, 34.90, 51.37)

If that's performing well, I'd hate to see someone who doesn't perform well.


As for Ali's "Excellent record", an average of 28 in First Class is hardly excellent, and although 20.68 in One Day isn't bad, he's still only had one good season from 3 reasonable goes, and that's not enough in my opinion.

 

[chris.hinton]

Giles is the test spinner

 

[chris.hinton]

One day team xi

Nick Knight
Marcus Trescothick
Michael Vaughan (Capt)
Ben Smith
Paul Collingwood
Andrew Flintoff
James Foster(W-K)
Ian Blackwell
Andy Caddick
Kabir Ali
James Anderson


Test Team

Marcus Trescothick
Michael Vaughan
Mark Butcher
Nasser Hussain (Capt)
Robert Key
Alec Stewart
Andrew Flintoff
Craig White
Andy Caddick
Kabir Ali
Ashely Giles ( No other spinner at the moment)
Steve Harminson


Bubbling Under

Ian Bell, Jim Trughton, Kyle Hogg, John Crawley, James Foster, Graeme Hick, Graham Swann,

 

[luckyeddie]

Bubbling Under

Ian Bell, Jim Trughton, Kyle Hogg, John Crawley, James Foster, Graeme Hick, Graham Swann,

If you can say Hick, I can say, er, someone else.

Come on!!!!! That really is silly. Why not go the whole hog and go for Rampers or Tuffers (hmmm, there's a name)?

 

[chris.hinton]

yeah ok you right but i was stugging to name younger players so i said Hick (He is still Quality)

 

[marc71178]

Which part of "Ben Smith is not going to get a chance" escapes your attention?

 

[Neil Pickup]

yeah ok you right but i was stugging to name younger players so i said Hick (He is still Quality)

I think that statement's enough to confirm that you are having trouble differentiating between England Internationals and County Cricketers.

And Hogg for the Test Squad? He's a maybe in a few years, but he has not hit a particularly strong level in the CC yet, for Lancashire he's picked as a bowler and is below Glenn Chapple with the bat...

How are you planning on getting 12 in the Test team?

 

[Rik]

Hmmmmm...why?:

1. Kabir Ali has not shown that he is worthy of a place in the ODI squad and where you got the idea of him playing in the Test team too...hmmmm...whatever your on can I have some?

2. Jamie Foster has not shown he is of Test class with the bat or of any standard in ODIs. Chris Read is my bet, and he's been performing all winter for the academy.

3. Ben Smith is too old and frankly hasn't done enough to grab the selector's attentions. What about Thorpe or someone else?

4. Vaughan...now ok he could be a good skipper, but if he has a poor year in ODIs and is dropped from the team...then what happens?

5. Quite oddly you favour Caddick (FC average 14) batting ahead of Ali (average 20) and Giles (average 27), and also, as Neil said, you picked 12 players.

6. Graeme Swann and Kyle Hogg have done nothing amazing of late.

7. Putting Hick back in the Test team is like picking Knight or Salisbury...it's just not going to work.

8. "Jim Trughton" and "Graham Swann", don't you mean Jim Troughton and Graeme Swann?

 

[chris.hinton]

Hmmmmm...why?:

1. Kabir Ali has not shown that he is worthy of a place in the ODI squad and where you got the idea of him playing in the Test team too...hmmmm...whatever your on can I have some?

2. Jamie Foster has not shown he is of Test class with the bat or of any standard in ODIs. Chris Read is my bet, and he's been performing all winter for the academy.

3. Ben Smith is too old and frankly hasn't done enough to grab the selector's attentions. What about Thorpe or someone else?

4. Vaughan...now ok he could be a good skipper, but if he has a poor year in ODIs and is dropped from the team...then what happens?

5. Quite oddly you favour Caddick (FC average 14) batting ahead of Ali (average 20) and Giles (average 27), and also, as Neil said, you picked 12 players.

6. Graeme Swann and Kyle Hogg have done nothing amazing of late.

7. Putting Hick back in the Test team is like picking Knight or Salisbury...it's just not going to work.

8. "Jim Trughton" and "Graham Swann", don't you mean Jim Troughton and Graeme Swann?

12 players would be the squad and the bowlers where in any order, Hick is 37 but still one of the best

 

[chris.hinton]

Which part of "Ben Smith is not going to get a chance" escapes your attention?

Who said that.......... oh and i never suggested that Hick will get picked i random picked players

 

[Neil Pickup]

12 players would be the squad and the bowlers where in any order, Hick is 37 but still one of the best

You quite clearly said "Test Team" and put forward Hick as a fringe player.

He's failed more times than Tim Henman. Period.