Best New Labour Prime Minister

[GIMH]

One bombed the **** out of Iraq and made great legislative strides in the never ending battle against individual liberty
One was in number eleven laying the foundations for the economic ruin he presided over as premier before dithering his way through a two year spell
One wants to read your WhatsApp messages and make being mean to politicians a crime


Tough call.

 

[Athlai]

Jacinda Ardern

 

[Furball]

Blair and Brown, for all their flaws, are still miles better than the rabble that preceded them and the rabble that's been in government for the last 8 years.

 

[GIMH]

Yeah I loved the Iraq War too

 

[GIMH]

And before you start. I consider the Falklands fair game. Gulf War, Libya, terrible but not on the level of Iraq.

**** Tony Blair

 

[Bijed]

In terms of just their tenure as PM, so discounting anything they did in other ministerial roles, has to be Brown, surely?

Not that you'd say he was a good PM, but > Blair anyway (low bar, admittedly)

I mean, I generally like to think of myself as someone who refrains from making outright rude remarks about people, but Blair was an absolute ****. **** him.

 

[_Ed_]

Yeah I loved the Iraq War too

And before you start. I consider the Falklands fair game. Gulf War, Libya, terrible but not on the level of Iraq.

**** Tony Blair

It was unforgivable, and IMO quite rightly casts a massive shadow over his legacy. But would it have been any different if the Conservatives were in power? Seem to remember Iain Duncan Smith being very pro-invasion.

 

[Niall]

It was unforgivable, and IMO quite rightly casts a massive shadow over his legacy. But would it have been any different if the Conservatives were in power? Seem to remember Iain Duncan Smith being very pro-invasion.

IDS was a bit of a hawk iirc. Who knows what would have happened if Kenneth Clarke had won the leadership for the tories as he was obviously less awful and against the war.

Blair did some good things, but when you consider the amount of deaths that it caused and the generations it radicalised, he can't ever be forgiven.

 

[Uppercut]

So it’s obviously Brown. GFC had pretty much nothing to do with him (clue’s in the name). And he didn’t invade anyone.

 

[Spark]

So it’s obviously Brown. GFC had pretty much nothing to do with him (clue’s in the name). And he didn’t invade anyone.

Haha yeah it's wild that this is a contest at all.

 

[GIMH]

I agree it’s Brown FTR

 

[GIMH]

It was unforgivable, and IMO quite rightly casts a massive shadow over his legacy. But would it have been any different if the Conservatives were in power? Seem to remember Iain Duncan Smith being very pro-invasion.

Oh aye, there were plenty of people on either side of the house who would have backed it. A lot of the support was based on the WMD stuff though. As PM, Blair has to bear responsibility for that IMO

 

[Uppercut]

Oh aye, there were plenty of people on either side of the house who would have backed it. A lot of the support was based on the WMD stuff though. As PM, Blair has to bear responsibility for that IMO

Yeah, there's a difference between "did Bad Thing" and "would almost definitely also have done Bad Thing".

But it is interesting that Blair only ever erred on the side of being too right-wing. The wars, authoritarianism, financial deregulation (YMMV), PFIs/PPPs (though those were moreso Brown) were all stolen from or heavily backed by the Tories. Harder to think of a time when he was too left-wing- I guess you would have to say immigration given the political economy effects, but all of his stuff on homelessness, minimum wage, child poverty was successful on its own terms. Very much frustrated younger-me that the population reacted by replacing him with a more right-wing government.

 

[Niall]

Pretty sure Gove and Big Dave were also big fans of Tony which tells you enough right there.

 

[Furball]

So it’s obviously Brown. GFC had pretty much nothing to do with him (clue’s in the name). And he didn’t invade anyone.

Arguably Brown and Darling were responsible for lessening the impact of the GFC.

We were recovering OK until that **** Osborne crashed the economy.

 

[Uppercut]

I think Brown handled it well, at least in the immediate aftermath. Sort of subjective though.

He did bang on a lot about how we’d moved past ‘the old boom and bust’. And by all reports he was temperamentally not suited to the job at all. But we’re only comparing him to other PMs so it’s a pretty low bar.

 

[GIMH]

Yeah, there's a difference between "did Bad Thing" and "would almost definitely also have done Bad Thing".

But it is interesting that Blair only ever erred on the side of being too right-wing. The wars, authoritarianism, financial deregulation (YMMV), PFIs/PPPs (though those were moreso Brown) were all stolen from or heavily backed by the Tories. Harder to think of a time when he was too left-wing- I guess you would have to say immigration given the political economy effects, but all of his stuff on homelessness, minimum wage, child poverty was successful on its own terms. Very much frustrated younger-me that the population reacted by replacing him with a more right-wing government.

Authoritarianism is not really a right wing trait, in my book anyway. But that was, after the wars, his worst trait.

Without getting into a debate about his ‘left wing’ measures, what option was there other than a move to the right? Governments just reach an end sometimes and it doesn’t matter whose fault it is, when the country is on its arse and a party has had over a decade of power then that time arrives.

 

[Uppercut]

Could’ve gone with the Lib Dems, they opposed both the war and the authoritarianism. They did sort of get elected in 2010 but didn’t increase their vote share much. I do see your point though.

 

[S.Kennedy]

Brown's tenure was rather forgettable, like an interregnum between Blair and the return of the Tories. Everyone thought he would be a socialist bruiser but he was completely ineffectual and gaffe prone.

 

[Spark]

Yeah, there's a difference between "did Bad Thing" and "would almost definitely also have done Bad Thing".

But it is interesting that Blair only ever erred on the side of being too right-wing. The wars, authoritarianism, financial deregulation (YMMV), PFIs/PPPs (though those were moreso Brown) were all stolen from or heavily backed by the Tories. Harder to think of a time when he was too left-wing- I guess you would have to say immigration given the political economy effects, but all of his stuff on homelessness, minimum wage, child poverty was successful on its own terms. Very much frustrated younger-me that the population reacted by replacing him with a more right-wing government.

Probably the broader population cares less about surface level ideology and "spectral" politics and more about stuff that seems non-ideological or non-partisan like competence. So for a lot of people, it's not so much that they prefer the other lot's ideology is that they feel the other lot should have a go.