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5th Test at The Oval, London

SteveNZ

Well-known member
Only thing with Roy, is that if hes being picked, should he not get a fair crack of the whip in his best FC position......his technique looks flawed, but if he was able to come in at say 150/2, he has the potential to take the game away from a side in an hour or so.
Ignoring the fact England won't be 150-2, that's a narrow basis for picking a Test #4. It's not going to make you a good Test side - it won't win you matches and series' v the better sides.

I hope England pick him for the tour to NZ. He's a hopeless Test player. I completely back Boult to make mince meat out of him.
 

aussie tragic

Well-known member
Resting Cummins would be the height of stupidity. He's got a long break before the next series after this one.
Resting Cummins has nothing to do with the next series. Australia has been promoting their bowler rotation policy to make sure there are fresh legs in each test.

Pattinson is fresh, while Cummins looked slightly cooked after his 4th straight test and Hazlewood may become cooked this game as it's his 4th straight.

Pattinson, Hazlewood, Starc, Lyon, Marsh should be the attack in the 5th.
 

stephen

Well-known member
Resting Cummins has nothing to do with the next series. Australia has been promoting their bowler rotation policy to make sure there are fresh legs in each test.

Pattinson is fresh, while Cummins looked slightly cooked after his 4th straight test and Hazlewood may become cooked this game as it's his 4th straight.

Pattinson, Hazlewood, Starc, Lyon, Marsh should be the attack in the 5th.
I do not agree with dropping the world #1 bowler.
 

aussie tragic

Well-known member
I do not agree with dropping the world #1 bowler.
Who said anything about dropping, it's resting to avoid injury/burn out after he bowled 48 overs last test and played 4 tests in 4 weeks or so.

Pattinson, Hazlewood, Starc combo still enough to do in an unchanged England.
 

SteveNZ

Well-known member
I do not agree with dropping the world #1 bowler.
But you're not dropping him, you're only ensuring he's not overworked. He's just played a full World Cup and a Test series that started mere days after it. And from what I've seen, he's put in 100% effort every time he's run to the crease during that period. He's such an incredible asset that I wouldn't be trying to wring one more match out of him that even if you shake it down, doesn't matter in the grand context.

And yeah, when you can play Pattinson, Hazelwood, Starc or Siddle, I mean that's a luxury you can afford to go with.
 

SteveNZ

Well-known member
Had a look at the stats for Australia today, was blown away that only two guys are averaging more than 27 and a half. And actually only two guys averaging under 30 with the ball if you exclude Labuschagne's solitary wicket. England having three under 30 and one just on, along with three over 30 with the bat.

Steve Smith aye. I saw someone scoff when Root said Smith was the difference between the two sides...but it's 100% true.
 

stephen

Well-known member
Yeah without Smith England are easily a better side than Australia. Our batting is really, horrifically bad.
 

Lillian Thomson

Well-known member
I don’t think anyone argues that he doesn’t make a huge difference. But bowlers win matches by taking 20 wickets. The relentless accuracy and penetration of the Australian attack is streets ahead of England who have had a lot of poor sessions and leaked runs at over 4 an over even when Smith hasn’t been batting.
 

stephen

Well-known member
Without Smith though the English bowling attack bowls less and is almost as good as Australia's.

Batting- wise, England have had Root, Burns, Barstow and Stokes all do pretty well with the bat, which is better than Australia who have had Labuschagne do alright and that's it.
 

aussie tragic

Well-known member
Batting- wise, England have had Root, Burns, Barstow and Stokes all do pretty well with the bat, which is better than Australia who have had Labuschagne do alright and that's it.
I guess the batting bar has moved if you think Root and Bairstow have done pretty well with the bat.

Root is averaging 30 and has 3 ducks, while Bairstow is averaging only 25 with 1 fifty (52).
 

Lillian Thomson

Well-known member
If anyone seriously thinks that England are easily the better side if you take Smith out there’s not much hope for anyone. When Smith didn’t play it took a freak innings for England to win despite bowling in the most bowler friendly conditions ever on the first day.
 

TimAngas

Well-known member
It's kind of a recent tradition for there to be left-field debuts in Ashes dead rubbers. Faulkner in 2013, Borthwick 2013/14, and in 2017/18 Crane. I propose the tradition continue and Neser debut at the oval.
 

SteveNZ

Well-known member
If anyone seriously thinks that England are easily the better side if you take Smith out there’s not much hope for anyone. When Smith didn’t play it took a freak innings for England to win despite bowling in the most bowler friendly conditions ever on the first day.
Certainly it wouldn't be 'easily'. But I think England would be favourites at home at least without Smith. And part of that is England's attack has just wilted at the mere sight of Smith. Lo and behold, when he's not there at Leeds they clean up the rest, albeit that it was a fairly conducive pitch.
 

Daemon

Well-known member
If injury/workload is a big worry then play Marsh and bowl Cummins a bit less. Australia can afford the bit of risk given there’s no other series coming up after this for a while.
 

the big bambino

Well-known member
If anyone seriously thinks that England are easily the better side if you take Smith out there’s not much hope for anyone. When Smith didn’t play it took a freak innings for England to win despite bowling in the most bowler friendly conditions ever on the first day.
This is the reason I didn't think the Leeds loss would damage Australia psychologically. To lose by one wicket and perhaps unluckily without the best batsman in either side would have been depressing but something you can overcome when you know Smith is coming back and you had the option of getting some variety and pace with Starc.
 

stephen

Well-known member
If anyone seriously thinks that England are easily the better side if you take Smith out there’s not much hope for anyone. When Smith didn’t play it took a freak innings for England to win despite bowling in the most bowler friendly conditions ever on the first day.
Australia have the better bowling but England have the better batting (Without Smith obviously). The thing is if England had have batted even somewhat normally in the first innings at Leeds the game wouldn't have even been close. As it was even getting dismissed for 67 didn't stop victory.
 
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