Burgey
Well-known member
I don’t follow how you concluded I’m a nationalist tbh. Accidents of birth shouldn’t give rise to some misplaced sense of pride in what is, after all, nothing more than a construct.
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**** Trotsky Said
- Thread starter harsh.ag
- Start date
Magrat Garlick
Global Moderator
he got an ice pick
that made his ears burn
that made his ears burn
Magrat Garlick
Global Moderator
the alternative universe USSR led by Trotsky takes Stalingrad out of the equation and Germany wins at Volgograd
S.Kennedy
Well-known member
Not a day goes by when you don't chastise somebody's country, usually either England or India (Chennai?), subjecting them to a torrent of xenophobic abuse whilst eulogising Australia in terms which would not be misplaced in 1930s Germany. Some of it is facetiousness and food related I'm sure, but...
Nah, reckon they'd have thrown the kitchen sink at defending Trotskygrad.the alternative universe USSR led by Trotsky takes Stalingrad out of the equation and Germany wins at Volgograd
Burgey
Well-known member
Yeah look, Stephen seems to be getting it here.
Stapel
Well-known member
Ah, the joy of alternative universes, better known as "What ifs"
I'll radically overdo this one, by claiming that, if Trotski had lost WWII, our world today would not have problems caused by Putin. And the Middle East would be an ISIS-free paradise, as it's root cause, the existance of a Jewish State, would never have happened.
On a serious note: The only what-if I really like, Is Winston Churchill's one on the Battle of Getysburg.
NZTailender
I can't believe I ate the whole thing
You're also forgetting about the previous years, in which Stalin's ruthless and brutal regime managed to industrialise and modernise by sheer force a nation that was woefully behind the times.
it wasn't 'good', it wasn't 'right', but it was one of the contributing factors as to how they could churn out so many god damn tanks and airplanes.
Part of signing a pact with Germany in the first place was to delay what they knew was inevitable. They needed time to build up. The purges were stupid in terms of military leadership though, hence Finland.
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andruid
Well-known member
Reckon he would have gotten behind the German, French and Italian Communists efforts to run their countries and meddled so much in the Spanish Civil War that WW2 would be a war on communism playing out in Western Europe.
S.Kennedy
Well-known member
Killing off the entirety of your officer corps in the 1930s army purges left the Red Army woefully short of experienced officers during Barbarossa and paranoid, fearful of ''mission command'' initiative, committed to head-on attacks. These institutional weaknesses were evident in The Winter War. Also, officers were hampered by NKVD commissars.
About industrialising, you've to remember that the localities at least of Soviet industrialising were overran in 1941. The Soviets relocated their industries across the Urals, but this took time.
About industrialising, you've to remember that the localities at least of Soviet industrialising were overran in 1941. The Soviets relocated their industries across the Urals, but this took time.
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NZTailender
I can't believe I ate the whole thing
Trotsky was more interested in spreading revolutions to other countries as he felt Russia at the time couldn't match the capitalist countries.
The only way this would've helped if he somehow nixed NAZI Germany before it even began.
The only way this would've helped if he somehow nixed NAZI Germany before it even began.
harsh.ag
Well-known member
Think we should all agree that all this talk of how Trotsky would have done against Hitler in WWII overlooks the fact that Trotsky would have started the communist revolution in Germany in the 20s itself had he come to power. Nazi Germany may never have existed and Europe would be a whole different kind of mess.
harsh.ag
Well-known member
"The more impotent the police regime of the Nazi is in the field of national economy, the more it is forced to transfer its efforts to the field of foreign policy. This corresponds fully to the inner dynamics of German capitalism, aggressive through and through. The sudden turn of the Nazi leaders to peaceful declarations could deceive only utter simpletons. What other method remains at Hitler’s disposal to transfer the responsibility for internal distresses to external enemies and to accumulate under the press of the dictatorship the explosive force of nationalism? This part of the program, outlined openly even prior to the Nazis” assumption of power, is now being fulfilled with iron logic before the eyes of the world. The date of the new European catastrophe will be determined by the time necessary for the arming of Germany. It is not a question of months, but neither is it a question of decades. It will be but a few years before Europe is again plunged into a war, unless Hitler is forestalled in time by the inner forces of Germany."
November 2, 1933
November 2, 1933