Reported mass shooting/ critical incident in Christchurch

[TNT]

The attacker did make IEDs, they failed, and he had access to vehicles.

Hardly like adding more gun legislation means that we're going to give up on preventing radicalisation. Im in full support of both things, not just one.

I dont disagree with gun controls, but whilst there is so much hate at the moment it has directed some of that hate towards responsible gun owners, like I said I think it is just bad timing.

 

[Athlai]

Well yeah, poor form to blame all gun owners or sellers. Particularly in NZ plenty are in favour of reform.

 

[ankitj]

You guys might not realize but all this "not all gun owners" kind of talk just doesn't sound sensible to us non Westerners. Ban the bloody guns, have fewer people dead. It's that simple.

 

[Spark]

You guys might not realize but all this "not all gun owners" kind of talk just doesn't sound sensible to us non Westerners. Ban the bloody guns, have fewer people dead. It's that simple.

Collective punishment being bad isn't, or shouldn't, be a strictly Western thing. Although having said that advocating for gun restrictions can be down without personal indictment on gun owners IMO.

 

[Ausage]

You guys might not realize but all this "not all gun owners" kind of talk just doesn't sound sensible to us non Westerners. Ban the bloody guns, have fewer people dead. It's that simple.

You think a single person who disagrees with tighter gun laws fails to understand the premise put forth on the other side?

It's possible to understand a premise while disagreeing with it..

 

[StephenZA]

I have no problem with gun owners; most are responsible people who use guns on farms, hunting, clay pigeon shooting other sports etc. I am actually a believer that all people should be taught how to handle and disarm a firearm, being scared of something always makes it worse.


None of that requires an assault style rifle/weapon whose sole design and purpose is to kill as many things (i.e. people) in an as short space of time as possible.

 

[TNT]

Collective punishment being bad isn't, or shouldn't, be a strictly Western thing. Although having said that advocating for gun restrictions can be down without personal indictment on gun owners IMO.

I assume you meant "done".

While emotions are still high its not the right time to take such action, let things cool down and then when everyone is more stable. Gun owners will be labeled white supremacists if they disagree with the controls even though they may have legitimate reasons..

 

[harsh.ag]

Wait for them to confront that problem when it actually happens imo. And I don't mean when it happens on Twitter.

 

[Mike5181]

Farmers, hunters, etc. don't need military-style semi-automatic and assault rifles. Public opinion is obviously different in the States but I just don't see much push back on a ban like that regardless of timing.

 

[Flem274*]

i was a farm kid. automatic weapons have one purpose, and it's not pest control.

all these "responsible gun owners" types wanting to discuss it when everything is calm really want to say "my right to own a weapon designed purely to kill humans is more important than your right to life and safety".

 

[Flem274*]

if you want to know what a selection of nz farmers think rather than just listening to me, im a member of one of the facebook farming groups. no one has ever said a good word about adern in there until last friday, and now while there is a loud contingent decrying this like the libertarians and inventing conspiracy theories about adern trying to strip farmers of everything, it says a lot that most farmers who otherwise despise labour and the greens are vehemently in favour of this.

 

[Spark]

if you want to know what a selection of nz farmers think rather than just listening to me, im a member of one of the facebook farming groups. no one has ever said a good word about adern in there until last friday, and now while there is a loud contingent decrying this like the libertarians and inventing conspiracy theories about adern trying to strip farmers of everything, it says a lot that most farmers who otherwise despise labour and the greens are vehemently in favour of this.

In my experience there are no worse salespeople for rural communities than those who often claim to speak on their behalf.

 

[TNT]

i was a farm kid. automatic weapons have one purpose, and it's not pest control.

all these "responsible gun owners" types wanting to discuss it when everything is calm really want to say "my right to own a weapon designed purely to kill humans is more important than your right to life and safety".

As long as rational doesn't go out the window.

 

[Athlai]

In my experience there are no worse salespeople for rural communities than those who often claim to speak on their behalf.

Wow some hot takes from Spark here.

 

[Spark]

Wow some hot takes from Spark here.

I'm referring to the "don't tread on me"/"heartland" types who pretend that culture wars are all rural people care about

 

[Grasshopper]

Yeah, how awful they must be to have a political opinion you disagree with.

Yeah, that. And guns.

 

[Top_Cat]

if you want to know what a selection of nz farmers think rather than just listening to me, im a member of one of the facebook farming groups. no one has ever said a good word about adern in there until last friday, and now while there is a loud contingent decrying this like the libertarians and inventing conspiracy theories about adern trying to strip farmers of everything, it says a lot that most farmers who otherwise despise labour and the greens are vehemently in favour of this.

Exactly.

Bears remembering that the prior to Port Arthur, there was popular support for auto weapons ban that tipped over into overwhelming support afterward. Apart from some grumbling about how little their grand daddy's antique rifle was valued at, the subsequent voluntary buyback brought in over a million guns, or, roughly half of what was estimated to be out there. There was a spike in the illegal firearms market that all Aussie police services made a corporate priority but it calmed down to a watching brief. What didn't happen was the auto ban becoming a total ban, mass stockpiling of Kalashnikovs nor has there been a single spree shooting since. Am generally sympathetic to the position that John Howard is an evil **** but he and his team got this one absolutely right.

This is the sort of advice I'd imagine has been fed to Andern as to what can be achieved. This, of course, would be completely impossible in the US.

 

[Flem274*]

i will make a slight addendum and say semi-auto rifles can be quite handy for nailing large numbers of invasive bird species before they can fly away, but aderns wording appears to focus on fully automatic and military semi autos (especially ones easily modified to be auto), so she's left a bit of room on the semi auto front. i'vr heard DOC have some semi autos in their "kill stuff" tool kit but someone more knowledgeable than i could confirm or deny that.

even if it's all semi-autos, their users need to take one for the team imo. pest control definitely doesn't require them.

 

[Grasshopper]

I see Destiny Cult leader Bogus Bishop Tamaki has objected to today's Islamic call to prayer. Something along the lines of "my sky fairy is real and theirs isn't". Thanks Brian, please stop breathing now. You're in overdraft.

 

[sledger]

The point is that in order to separate responsible gun owners from the ones that are stocking up for a killing spree, you need certain blanket measures. Similar measures are needed to separate a potential airplane hijacker from the average traveller.

It's not a perfect analogy but the point stands imo.

Blanket measures of any sort are rarely good imo. Hardly ever a proportionate response to whatever supposed "good" they are trying to achieve.

Edit: This has nothing to do specially with what has happened in NZ btw, just a general observation.